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knightmare.com
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| 13:50:59 |
Forester | entered the channel
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Darren | entered the channel
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Zod | entered the channel
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| 21:53:38 |
Darren | is it only us three that comes here every other day other than sunday?
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LordF | disconnected
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| 21:54:57 |
Zod | left the channel
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| 21:55:21 |
Darren | gulps shouldn't have done that >_>
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| 21:56:37 |
Billy | entered the channel
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| 21:56:47 |
Billy | ...oh right, I thought you meant, like, lots of people.
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| 21:57:07 |
Darren | erm... sorry
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| 21:57:16 |
Darren | I was expecting there to be, I just invited every KM contact on my list here
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| 21:57:26 |
Darren | But i'll still be chatty enough for everyone I guess
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| 21:57:30 |
Darren | how has your week been?
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| 21:57:34 |
Darren | hopefully decent!
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| 21:57:53 |
Billy | Slightly stressy but slightly good, started taking dance classes and am loving them.
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| 21:58:01 |
Kira | entered the channel
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| 21:58:13 |
Lewis | entered the channel
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| 21:58:18 |
Darren | Hello Lewis!
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| 21:58:51 |
Darren | how are you doing?
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| 21:59:04 |
Darren | Yeah I read on facebook about these dance classes
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| 21:59:08 |
Kira | So, ym. I've never come in here as Kira before, have I? You guys know me as Ciaran. I should probably say that.
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| 21:59:08 |
Darren | what made you take them up?
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| 21:59:14 |
Lewis | I'm alright thanks, you?
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| 21:59:20 |
Darren | ok thanks Lewis
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| 21:59:23 |
Darren | how have you been?
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| 21:59:43 |
Billy | Hehe that's ok, I read about on LJ so knew it was you.
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| 21:59:43 |
Kira | I need to fix my hostmask too, but I'll do that in a sec.
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| 22:00:03 |
Billy | Regent's Park was filled with a Swing Dance Picnic on Sunday and it looked really cool, and someone there told me about them.
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| 22:00:29 |
Billy | There's about three times as many females as males but am really enjoying it.
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| 22:01:36 |
Darren | well that's all that matters
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| 22:01:59 |
Darren | besides, all those girls around is a good thing right? =P
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| 22:02:27 |
Billy | Hehe I guess so! It's harder being the man because you have to lead, your dancing partner basically just copies you...
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| 22:02:55 |
Billy | Will keep me occupied throughout the summer, anyway!
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| 22:03:10 |
Kieran | entered the channel
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| 22:03:21 |
Darren | Hello Kieran
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| 22:03:32 |
Kieran | Mr B, Mr D. Yello.
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| 22:03:36 |
Darren | damn I was about to call him that, but settled for the more formal greeting
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| 22:04:00 |
Kira | Oh yeah. About that female thing. I guess I should probably say something about that.
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| 22:04:08 |
Darren | makes a nice change to see old faces here again
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| 22:04:20 |
Kieran | Pfft. Old faces...
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| 22:04:23 |
Darren | or just old faces in general! *looks over at Kieran*
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| 22:04:34 |
Kieran | Behave yourself
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| 22:04:54 |
Kira | (for the record, I hadn't meant to come in here as Kira. Normally I'm okay at keeping names until I'm sure I want to talk about it. Looks like I slipped up in this case.)
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| 22:05:17 |
Darren | Its alright, I knew who you were at least, because as soon as you gave me the OK, you were straight in here =P
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| 22:05:46 |
Kira | (Which is strange, as I must have specifically set myself to use this nick in here, and I wouldn't normally do that. Oh well.)
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| 22:06:03 |
Kira | So, yeah. Hi, I'm Kira, formerly known as Ciaran.
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| 22:06:11 |
Kira | FAQ: Yes, Kira is a female name. Yes,
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| 22:06:16 |
Kira | Yes, Ciaran is a male name.
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| 22:07:26 |
Kira | For those who don't know what I'm talking about, I'm transgendered.
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| 22:07:35 |
Kira | And I hadn't meant to come out here in quite this fashion, but hey.
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| 22:07:42 |
Kira | 'tis all good.
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| 22:09:36 |
Billy | Sounds like we've all had very unique years!
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| 22:09:36 |
Kira | is also a great conversation killer, apparently. ^^
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| 22:09:58 |
Kieran | Nah it's just Darren, he's useless at talking.
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| 22:10:51 |
Kieran | 2008 is becoming a very unique year indeed.
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| 22:10:54 |
Kieran | In the good sense.
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| 22:11:21 |
Darren | I'm busy with things!
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| 22:11:50 |
Darren | 2008 is a bit bleh at the moment, lets see if I can complete this course before the year is out
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| 22:12:12 |
Billy | Ooh what course?
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| 22:14:00 |
Kieran | Something to make him more useful, I hope.
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| 22:16:23 |
Kieran | So...How is everyone this evening, in general?
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| 22:16:33 |
Kieran | Nice to see a reasonable number in here on a Friday.
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| 22:18:24 |
Darren | Yes it is!
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| 22:18:31 |
Darren | well, i'm not doing much, as usual =P
|
| 22:18:35 |
Darren | well, I am
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| 22:18:43 |
Darren | going over these diagnostics again
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| 22:18:47 |
Darren | just to ensure i'm good for the exam
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| 22:19:27 |
Billy | When's the exam?
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| 22:19:37 |
Billy | In general, yeah, very good. Working out my weekend plans.
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| 22:28:29 |
Kieran | Anything 'worked out'?
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| 22:28:46 |
Billy | I think it depends on how much it rains.
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| 22:29:31 |
Kieran | Outdoor plans?
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| 22:30:27 |
Billy | Yeah, there's a few outdoor things going on but if it rains it's a bit pointless.
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| 22:32:21 |
Darren | exam is at a nearby learn direct center
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| 22:32:25 |
Darren | sorry, had to nip downstairs for a bit
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| 22:32:33 |
Darren | check to see if mum needed a hand with anything
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| 22:33:23 |
worMatty | disconnected
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| 22:36:37 |
Kira | Sorry, was eating just then.
|
| 22:36:47 |
Kira | I'm doing fairly well.
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| 22:36:52 |
Kira | Lots has been happening lately.
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| 22:37:18 |
Kieran | Good things?
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| 22:37:32 |
Kira | BTW, if anyone has any questions about this whole thing, I'm more than happy to answer them.
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| 22:38:50 |
Kira | (about the whole transgendered thing, I mean)
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| 22:39:09 |
Kira | (or if anybody's uncomfortable, let me know that too)
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| 22:39:55 |
Billy | I think it's awesome, I don't know anyone else who is.
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| 22:40:34 |
Kieran | I am sure nobody is uncomfortable at all. Certain. :)
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| 22:40:44 |
Kira | Who's awesome? Well, thanks, I didn't know you thought that highly of me. ;)
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| 22:42:48 |
Billy | Hehe I know :p
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| 22:42:51 |
Kira | (as in, you don't know anybody else who's awesome? :P Sorry, I didn't make it clear, just realised it was probably not that clear)
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| 22:44:12 |
Billy | I meant I don't know anyone else who's transgender, you're the first!
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| 22:44:53 |
Kira | I know you meant that. I was just teasing. :D
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| 22:45:29 |
Kira | Not very good at jokes, apparently. :D
|
| 22:55:14 |
Kieran | I know someone at work who is, actually.
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| 22:59:24 |
Billy | Is their name Harry Hill?
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| 22:59:28 |
Kira | Are you sure this topic isn't making people uncomfortable? Normally there'd be conversations going on right now. I don't mind if it is making people uncomfortable, but please do say. I won't be offended.
|
| 22:59:53 |
Kira | (Sorry, I'm hypersensitive about not making people uncomfortable)
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| 22:59:59 |
Billy | Nah it's generally like this, don't worry.
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| 23:01:21 |
Darren | no i'm just doing some diagnostic tests for my course
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| 23:01:22 |
Darren | you're cool
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| 23:01:32 |
Kieran | Yes don't worry, there's not many of us in here anyway.
|
| 23:01:39 |
Kieran | Talks can get a little slow these days
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| 23:02:51 |
Darren | we're all getting on in our old age you see *looks over to Kieran once again*
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| 23:03:12 |
Kira | You're not *that* old.
|
| 23:03:27 |
Darren | then who am I to judge? I'm losing my hair and I look older than I am anyway!
|
| 23:03:36 |
Darren | someone said I looked 30 the other week, i got so offended!
|
| 23:04:06 |
Kieran | Oi just because I have been haunting this website/chatroom for over 8 years don't mean I am an elder :-P
|
| 23:04:28 |
Darren | kieran you so are!
|
| 23:04:31 |
Billy | I tried three supermarkets - one twice - a few Sundays ago to try and get some alcohol and all refused to serve me.
|
| 23:04:47 |
Billy | So I guess I don't look over 18...
|
| 23:04:52 |
Kira | Is that lucky or unlucky?
|
| 23:04:59 |
Darren | my friend David is 25 and he got asked for ID
|
| 23:05:12 |
Billy | Well, I'm glad that I'm not getting asked for ID, but a bit pissed off because I wanted the booze...
|
| 23:05:16 |
Kieran | Cos he looks 12, from certain angles :-P
|
| 23:05:22 |
Darren | thats a thought, don't you have ID?
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| 23:05:31 |
Billy | My passport is in the post.
|
| 23:05:48 |
Darren | should be getting one of those soon
|
| 23:07:26 |
Kieran | I am beginning to look a lot older than my passport photo.
|
| 23:07:27 |
Billy | They recently changed the laws so that every single person over 16 now must have an interview.
|
| 23:08:01 |
Billy | So I've got to ring them up, book an interview, travel halfway across London to the interview office, etc, etc...I don't really have the time.
|
| 23:08:50 |
Billy | I think it's an anti-terrorist thing.
|
| 23:08:55 |
Kira | The trouble in my case is that since I know I'm going to want to be changing my legal name, it would probably be less hassle for me to wait.
|
| 23:09:15 |
Kira | I'm still not sure exactly how I'm going to do things yet.
|
| 23:11:39 |
Billy | Yeah it's a tricky situation.
|
| 23:11:58 |
Kieran | It's a rather permanent thing that you're after, then
|
| 23:13:26 |
Kira | Well, yes. I'm a male-to-female transsexual. And I know the word "transsexual" makes me sound like some sort of person who likes to dress in women's clothes for the fun of it, but that's not it at all; that's a crossdresser. This is different.
|
| 23:14:55 |
Kira | This isn't actually about anything sexual. The thing is, I don't feel male, at all. Never have.
|
| 23:15:34 |
Kira | (if you want, I can explain about things in here, but if you'd rather I didn't, that's cool.)
|
| 23:15:54 |
Kira | (But I figure some of you may be interested; let me know.)
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| 23:16:28 |
Kieran | I think there is an interest. Go ahead.
|
| 23:17:28 |
Kieran | You say never at all. You were quite sure from early age, then?
|
| 23:18:30 |
Kira | Not that I was female, no. That I didn't feel male at all, yes. The two sound like they're the same thing, but they're not.
|
| 23:19:38 |
Kira | In truth, for most of my life I haven't really thought that I was female. I've identified to others - and to myself - as male.
|
| 23:19:57 |
Kira | Because, well, it didn't occur to me I could be anything *but* male. It just... didn't.
|
| 23:20:21 |
Kira | Because, of course, not feeling male and not *being* male are also two different things.
|
| 23:20:28 |
Kieran | Yes I see what you mean
|
| 23:21:20 |
Kira | However, there have been times quite early in my life when I've wished I was female.
|
| 23:21:52 |
Billy | Yeah I remember you mentioning them on LJ.
|
| 23:21:55 |
Kieran | There's a gulf between mental and physical aspects, as there is betwene being one thing or the other.
|
| 23:22:04 |
Kira | As in, so strong that at the age of 10 or thereabouts, I remember quite vividly times when I'd go into the bathroom (being the only room with a lock), locking myself in, then just crying because I wasn't female.
|
| 23:23:34 |
Kira | The emotions of that have stuck with me. I remember how it felt, how frustrating it was.
|
| 23:23:37 |
Darren | That must have been very difficult for you
|
| 23:24:28 |
Kira | agrees with Caei.
|
| 23:24:31 |
Caei | darks with Kira in return
|
| 23:24:49 |
Kira | In any case...
|
| 23:25:48 |
Kira | Like I said, for most of my life I've identified as male, though not strongly.
|
| 23:26:20 |
Kira | I've never 'tried' to be male.
|
| 23:27:15 |
Kira | And I hated being known as a man. At the time I put this down to the fact that I'm pretty young at heart, too.
|
| 23:28:09 |
Billy | Like the Bluebells song.
|
| 23:28:55 |
Kira | But there was more to it than that. For example, my church (Trinity Methodist Church) has a men's group called Men@Trinity, and although I've been invited lots of times to go, I've never gone, except for one time when I *had* to go because I was doing the projections for it. (I operate the projection laptop on a rota.)
|
| 23:29:13 |
Kira | I've n ever been because I would have hated it.
|
| 23:29:46 |
Kira | The time I did go, I felt like I didn't fit in.
|
| 23:30:47 |
Kieran | There's a Trinity Church not far away from me, actually
|
| 23:30:59 |
Kieran | Or there was 10 years ago anyway...
|
| 23:31:04 |
Kieran | Think it's sitll there
|
| 23:31:16 |
Kira | You could look it up on Google Maps.
|
| 23:31:39 |
Kira | Trinity isn't an uncommon name for a church by any means, of course. ;p
|
| 23:32:04 |
Kieran | No, indeed. There's 1 or 2 of them about ;)
|
| 23:32:42 |
Lewis | disconnected
|
| 23:32:46 |
Kieran | Ah yes, I was right. It's just beyond Fleetwood.
|
| 23:34:54 |
Kieran | Make mine a Big Mac.
|
| 23:35:29 |
Kira | But, yes. The revelation about finding who I actually was started in February.
|
| 23:35:46 |
Kira | Now, I'd always been interested in gender identity, considering how I felt.
|
| 23:36:25 |
Kira | I had trans friends and knew about transsexualism. But it still hadn't occurred to me that I might be one.
|
| 23:37:21 |
Kira | Until one time I was at a filk convention, and met some transgendered people in the flesh, which I'd never done before.
|
| 23:37:59 |
Kira | And we talked. I was suddenly much more interested in transgender issues than I had been before.
|
| 23:38:34 |
Kieran | Hmm. so it conjured up a little interest.
|
| 23:38:57 |
Billy | It's incredible how something like that can happen!
|
| 23:39:26 |
Kira | Because I could see for myself how it went. I think it kind of kicked my brain into gear, seeing that it could actually happen, that these people were realising their dreams, as it were.
|
| 23:39:40 |
Kira | That's kind of the wrong way to put it, but you know.
|
| 23:39:41 |
Kieran | A fob watch moment, so to speak.
|
| 23:40:04 |
Kira | What do you mean by that?
|
| 23:40:14 |
Kira | I don't know that phrase.
|
| 23:40:32 |
Kieran | Well erm...It's not a phrase, it's just paraphrasing a device used in a TV program.
|
| 23:40:46 |
Kieran | Someone's personality locked awya inside a fob watch, conjured up by others.
|
| 23:41:46 |
Kira | Ah. I guess based on the way you're saying "a TV program" that it wasn't Knightmare, then. I don't remember that device being used in Knightmare. :D
|
| 23:42:04 |
Kira | But kind of, I guess. I haven't seen that device before.
|
| 23:42:11 |
Kieran | Heh no not quite!
|
| 23:42:26 |
Kieran | It's a Dr WHo reference. A selfish one on my part.
|
| 23:42:40 |
Kira | I don't watch Dr Who.
|
| 23:42:56 |
Kieran | This is what I feared :-D
|
| 23:43:20 |
Kira | (don't watch Torchwood either, though I hear it's good)
|
| 23:43:40 |
Kira | In fact, I watch very little TV.
|
| 23:43:45 |
Billy | I saw a clip of John Barrowman as a young 20-something being attacked by Mr Blobby in 1993 on youtube.
|
| 23:43:50 |
Billy | They should work it into the next series.
|
| 23:43:51 |
Kieran | It's definitel worth a watch.
|
| 23:43:54 |
Darren | Well Summer has finally begun!
|
| 23:44:03 |
Billy | Yep, we just had the summer solistice!
|
| 23:45:18 |
Kira | But yeah, just to finish up a bit... in February I started having a Deep Think about what I really wanted in my life, about who I really was.
|
| 23:45:37 |
Billy | And that's when you made the decision?
|
| 23:46:19 |
Kira | It wasn't really a sudden decision as such. It was more of a working things through.
|
| 23:46:49 |
Kira | You would know, Billy, you've seen my journal entries on the matter. :D
|
| 23:47:49 |
Billy | Ah yep of course, sorry!
|
| 23:47:50 |
Kira | I think I did make the actual decision fairly early on in that, but it took a while for me to realise that I was okay with that.
|
| 23:47:57 |
Kira | No, don't be sorry.
|
| 23:48:54 |
Darren | Have pitty on him
|
| 23:49:20 |
Darren | or pity rather
|
| 23:49:33 |
Kieran | Who are you, Merlin or something?
|
| 23:51:22 |
Kira | By now, I know enough to know for sure that this is what I want. I've been thinking almost non-stop about this since February, and I've had to work through a lot of stuff. I was questioning myself left, right and centre on various things.
|
| 23:51:50 |
Kira | Questions like, if I really was transsexual, why did it take me this long to figure it out?
|
| 23:52:30 |
Kira | It's a good question.
|
| 23:52:52 |
Billy | Sometimes it can take a long time to figure something out.
|
| 23:53:40 |
Kira | Yeah. Most of the stuff you read or hear about it though indicates they felt like this from an early age, and I just don't remember anything like that.
|
| 23:53:49 |
Kira | I do actually have a theory on that.
|
| 23:54:12 |
Kira | But it's somewhat upsetting and I don't really want to relate it. It wouldn't surprise me if it were true, however.
|
| 23:56:30 |
Kieran | Well, these things don't necessarily have to relate to age.
|
| 23:57:45 |
Kira | Early on in my Deep Think I looked for IRC networks and channels devoted to these things.
|
| 23:57:52 |
Kira | They helped quite a bit.
|
| 23:59:07 |
Kieran | Did you find people in a similar situaiton as yourself?
|
| 23:59:25 |
Kira | Yes, along with people who had been through it already.
|
| 00:00:48 |
Kira | At first I went in as Ciaran, but it wasn't long until I took the name Kira.
|
| 00:01:56 |
Kira | I chose the name because it's close enough to be pronounced almost the same way (just without the final 'n' - 'Keera'), but far enough away spelling-wise to be very different.
|
| 00:02:16 |
Billy | I think that's the cool thing about the internet, how easy it's made certain situations.
|
| 00:02:16 |
Kira | I wanted the pronunciation to be similar to emphasise that I was the same person. I wasn't changing.
|
| 00:02:46 |
Kira | No kidding. I hate to think how it must have been for transsexuals before the Internet.
|
| 00:03:06 |
Billy | It's sometimes interesting to think what your life would have been like had you been born ten years earlier, so, for me, being 19 but in the year 1998.
|
| 00:03:20 |
Billy | The things I use most are my digital camera, my iPod, the internet and Facebook. None of them existed then.
|
| 00:03:39 |
Billy | But yeah that as well.
|
| 00:03:44 |
Kira | Er, yes, the Internet did exist. I should know, I was on it.
|
| 00:03:55 |
Kira | From home, even.
|
| 00:04:00 |
Billy | Oh sorry, yeah :p For me it didn't though.
|
| 00:06:05 |
Caei | I've lost my little start thingy.
|
| 00:06:14 |
Kira | I think the thing to bear in mind with transsexuals is that they're not *wrong*. Gender and sex are two different things.
|
| 00:06:29 |
Kira | Caei: Try looking in the bottom-left of your screen.
|
| 00:07:17 |
Kieran | Certainly not wrong.
|
| 00:07:28 |
Kira | So, it's not like transsexuals bgelieve they have female genitalia when they clearly haven't, for example.
|
| 00:07:54 |
Kira | It's that their gender is female, even while their physical sex is male. Or vice versa.
|
| 00:09:38 |
Kira | So, yeah, to sum up... I'm female. I'm much more comfortable with myself being known as a female, and I'd appreciate female pronouns when referring to me ("she", "her", etc) - although I won't bite your head off if you forget, since I'm not yet fully public.
|
| 00:10:17 |
Kira | I can understand that some people will find it hard to think of me as female.
|
| 00:10:20 |
Kieran | We'll keep that in mind I am sure
|
| 00:10:25 |
Billy | Okey doke sure. Should be easier with your name being Kira :p
|
| 00:10:45 |
Kira | But I'd appreciate the effort, if you're willing. :)
|
| 00:11:05 |
Kira | It's not easy.
|
| 00:11:22 |
Kira | Oh, that reminds me.
|
| 00:13:07 |
Kira | Hang on, going to fix my hostmask.
|
| 00:13:28 |
Kira | disconnected
|
| 00:13:30 |
Kira | entered the channel
|
| 00:25:16 |
Billy | I think I'll get some shuteye, it won't be long before sunrise!
|
| 00:25:20 |
Billy | Bye all and have a super weekend!
|
| 00:26:30 |
Billy | disconnected
|
| 00:30:27 |
Darren | meh bye billy
|
| 00:30:30 |
Darren | missed him again
|
| 00:42:41 |
Kieran | Heading off myself. Have a nice night, all.
|
| 00:42:46 |
Kieran | disconnected
|
| 00:45:07 |
Kira | I'm missing people. :(
|
| 00:45:49 |
Darren | I had best be off too
|
| 00:45:50 |
Darren | its getting late
|
| 00:45:52 |
Darren | thanks for coming
|
| 00:45:54 |
Darren | take care :)
|
| 00:45:56 |
Darren | disconnected
|
| 01:03:07 |
Caei | It's a nightie, it's a plane, no... it's a bird.
|
| 01:20:12 |
Kira | Sleepytime for me. I wouldn't normally say that in a room wuth just bots in, but it's Friday/Saturday and Cypher's logging, so. *waves to anyone reading the logs*
|
| 01:31:06 |
Caei | did you see that..
|
|
|
